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 Post subject: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 7:20 am 
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So this was the latest episode and thank goodness. As a Canadian expat in South Korea, I live and breathe for the latest episodes. I only listen to a few and Dan, this is one of my favourites. I'm sorry to see where your media has gotten to. I also fear the Canadian media will head this way, but then I see legislation has been past in my old country to stop media from out right lying to the public and that always makes me happy, but I'm sure it still happens. The question always remains what can we as the public do to prevent such madness. Here in South Korea the stuff that gets plastered in the media would I think even surprise those back in America and Canada. Well, I just tried to find this terrible link about how those of us from outside of Korea just want to find Korean girls and get their money and flee; the youtube link to MBC (one of the major news sources down here) has been deleted; so now I feel like I'm talkin' out my ass. But again; I'm so sorry for where your American news media has gone. We have laws up North to stop it and Freedom of the Press is the best, but hell there should be a line drawn and where the truth can be told and where lies are the truth.


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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 7:50 am 
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Lightstarr wrote:
I'm sorry to see where your media has gotten to. I also fear the Canadian media will head this way, but then I see legislation has been past in my old country to stop media from out right lying to the public and that always makes me happy, but I'm sure it still happens.

Legislation is a powerfull tool, but stick around this board for little while and you'll see that alot of people here are very very very sceptical of any legislation, beliving that since the politicians are corrupt the laws will also be corrupt and thus more harm then good. Given that I want to ask if you could explain/link to those Canadian laws you speak of so people can get a sense of what such laws look like.

Great show Dan, although haven't we heard this show before?

Q for Dan: Could you accomplish the same goal with PBS? Why, why not?
(perhaps slightly easier to get your hands on)

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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:00 am 
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Kolokol888 wrote:

Great show Dan, although haven't we heard this show before?


In some ways, yes. I even asked Ben if it was too derivative of earlier episodes...but as he pointed out, we are making connections that are new, to various ideas we have played with in several other episodes. So it's like (as an analogy) we are making a cake...and we have used the same ingredients before...but we are mixing them in different ways to end up with a slightly different end result (and maybe drawing some different conclusions...or new angles).

It's not easy to do 200+ shows on current events and not discuss much of the same stuff. In addition, you can't assume the audience is "up to speed" and has heard everything you've (we've) done. In radio, they repeat the same stuff over and over (assuming you either didn't catch, or don't really recall the earlier versions). In podcasting, I certainly feel we need to repeat ideas and concepts LESS often...but surely they re-occur. When they do, I try to freshen them up with new approaches and tie-ins and the like. I assume all the long-time listeners usually "get" where I'm coming from anyway. Now, even though they already know this, can I keep them entertained and challenged and interested anyway? That's the way I see the challenge/goal when I consider the needs of those who have already listened to us for a long time...


Hope that makes sense. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:43 am 
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Dan Quayle "brought down" George H.W. Bush? What smack were you smoking in the 80s?

To remind our younger members how Dan Quayle "destroyed" Bush I's election results in 1988..

Electoral Votes in 1988:
George HW Bush: 426
Michael Dukakis: 111

States won by Bush include such conservative stalwarts as Connecticut, New Jersey, Delaware, Vermont, Maryland and....drum roll please.... Cali-fucking-fornia.

What a crappy VP pick will do for your chances as a Republican:
Image

Image
Know what they called this dumbass, terrible VP pick for 4 years?
Mr. Vice-President.

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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:44 am 
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I'll start with beating a dead horse...

As I was walking down the hill with my 4 dogs*, you got to the part where you gave the stats for TOTAL CNN viewership. At that moment I thought, "Hooray! I'll post and thank Dan for no longer disenfranchising the elderly!"

But then you did. So I guess I can glory in the fact that now I count, just not as much as a "prime demographic".

So it goes...

One other point:

You mentioned CNN being aired in I think airports and waiting rooms. In the South, where I live, its more often Fox News. By a wide margin.

Yet another one other point:

I'm a "cable shaver", having cut DishNetwork back to a bare bones subscription. As such, I get Fox News but not CNN. Not sure the relevance, but it must factor in the numbers somewhere.


Image

Clockwise from left: Willie, Jake, Chowder and Halo!


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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:13 am 
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boethius wrote:
Dan Quayle "brought down" George H.W. Bush? What smack were you smoking in the 80s?

To remind our younger members how Dan Quayle "destroyed" Bush I's election results in 1988..

Electoral Votes in 1988:
George HW Bush: 426
Michael Dukakis: 111

States won by Bush include such conservative stalwarts as Connecticut, New Jersey, Delaware, Vermont, Maryland and....drum roll please.... Cali-fucking-fornia.

What a crappy VP pick will do for your chances as a Republican:
Image

Image
Know what they called this dumbass, terrible VP pick for 4 years?
Mr. Vice-President.


Quayle hurt Bush more in 1992...not in 1988. Dukakis was a terrible candidate who wasn't going to win regardless. Awful main ticket choice. But Quayle was a baffling pick for a G.W. Bush running mate. And he WAS a dumbass (noticed him playing any meaningful role in U.S. politics before his VP term or since? I met him privately...he WAS a male Sarah Palin...exactly).

An idiot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRCWbFFRpnY


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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:17 am 
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Fast Eddie B wrote:
I'll start with beating a dead horse...

As I was walking down the hill with my 4 dogs*, you got to the part where you gave the stats for TOTAL CNN viewership. At that moment I thought, "Hooray! I'll post and thank Dan for no longer disenfranchising the elderly!"

But then you did. So I guess I can glory in the fact that now I count, just not as much as a "prime demographic".

So it goes...

One other point:

You mentioned CNN being aired in I think airports and waiting rooms. In the South, where I live, its more often Fox News. By a wide margin.

Yet another one other point:

I'm a "cable shaver", having cut DishNetwork back to a bare bones subscription. As such, I get Fox News but not CNN. Not sure the relevance, but it must factor in the numbers somewhere.


Image

Clockwise from left: Willie, Jake, Chowder and Halo!


I mentioned you specifically...and then why it's not MY measurement that demeans you...but the industry's. THEY'RE the ones who charge the premiums for advertisers for reaching the 25-54 age group...not I. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:21 am 
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The thing that stuck out to me the most is the calls for Dan to be leader Why? Because we find his commentary insightful and worth listening too? Why in the world does being able to read trends = must do something about them? It is two entirely different skill sets.

It smacked to me like the OWS protests, they didn't NEED to come up with a replacement, just saying this isn't good enough IS enough. A good chunk of America dismissed them because we no longer believe you can even acknowledge the problem without coming up with a viable alternative that satisfies everyone. That is crazy talk at it's highest and why we skipped over the "do something about it" stage

What is it in our psyche that requires the idea guy to be the leader guy? Why do we dismiss people who aren't the whole package? Maybe this exact idea is why we don't have leaders any more, we expect too much of them and punish them for not living up to our superhero expectations. Dan is great at what he does, why push him to be something more because he is great at one thing? (well more than one thing, but darn it I am on a good rant)

As for the idea put forth, I thought it was great and I might even get a TV again to watch something like that. if only for the ben-a-thons in a visual form.

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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:25 am 
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Dan wrote:

Quayle hurt Bush more in 1992...not in 1988. Dukakis was a terrible candidate who wasn't going to win regardless. Awful main ticket choice. But Quayle was a baffling pick for a G.W. Bush running mate. And he WAS a dumbass (noticed him playing any meaningful role in U.S. politics before his VP term or since? I met him privately...he WAS a male Sarah Palin...exactly).

An idiot.


I remember thinking Dan Quayle was a brilliant choice, just like Cheney. who in the world wanted either Quayle or Cheney as the head guy? That is about as assassin proof as a human being can get.

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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:05 am 
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Dan wrote:
Quayle hurt Bush more in 1992...not in 1988. Dukakis was a terrible candidate who wasn't going to win regardless. Awful main ticket choice. But Quayle was a baffling pick for a G.W. Bush running mate. And he WAS a dumbass (noticed him playing any meaningful role in U.S. politics before his VP term or since? I met him privately...he WAS a male Sarah Palin...exactly).

An idiot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRCWbFFRpnY



I would also argue that George HW Bush was riding the coat tails of a the Regan era which helped him enormously in '88 instead of his VP pick.

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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:13 am 
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Thothgirl wrote:
The thing that stuck out to me the most is the calls for Dan to be leader Why? Because we find his commentary insightful and worth listening too? Why in the world does being able to read trends = must do something about them? It is two entirely different skill sets.


For me, I think that Dan could be a great leader just in comparison to anybody else leading anything in this country right now. I think Dan is one of the best thinkers in the country, at least when talking about political/social issues and history and his ability to articulate them in an intelligent. It is helpful to be able to see trends, so you can avoid mistakes and see the forest for the trees. It's frustrating to see so many leaders that don't seem to have any ability to think critically or stick to any principles, so I just wish there was a guy like Dan we had to follow. Obviously that's asking a lot, so I'm not holding my breath.


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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:08 am 
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Dan wrote:

Quayle hurt Bush more in 1992...not in 1988. Dukakis was a terrible candidate who wasn't going to win regardless. Awful main ticket choice. But Quayle was a baffling pick for a G.W. Bush running mate. And he WAS a dumbass (noticed him playing any meaningful role in U.S. politics before his VP term or since? I met him privately...he WAS a male Sarah Palin...exactly).

An idiot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRCWbFFRpnY

Bush breaking his no new taxes pledge + Ross Perot siphoning conservative/libertarian votes + Bill Clinton's political genius running as a center-right New Democrat = Clinton's 43% victory over Bush.

No VP pick of Bush's could have made a difference in '92:



Clinton rolled a natural 18 for Empathy. The look on Bush's face at 1:24 is priceless ("holy shit, he's killing me")

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"How about you just suck on a cyanide lollipop and spare us your fucking hyperbole you whining little nancy?" -- Cid

"If Dan had a lick of sense he'd have booted your pompous ass ages ago." - RAnthony


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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:41 am 
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@Dan

The MIC has already heard you loud and clear on GWOT/G-COIN. That's being turned over to civilian agencies and private contractors for mostly domestic operations.

The Pentagon recognizes that asymmetrical/low intensity threat is not going to pay the bills, hence; the "Strategic" shift, ostensibly to Asia, but really it amounts to a more global effort to provoke and stoke. Shove the Chinese and the Russians at times, jump in their path at others, supply both sides of the Indo-Pakistani conflict, lord Israel over the Persians, meddling in the Caucasus' et cetera.

Terrorism is so 2003. That's automatic in the system now, but it can't actually replace the Cold War, as the Long War.

Intermediate Nuclear Forces. Launch on Tactical Warning. Counter Ballistic Missile. Air/Sea Battle. There's gold in dem hills (again). The Semi-Warriors are going back into the huddle and repackaging "Flexible Response".

Back to the Future. The nuclear threat is the centerpiece of executive power, as you say, but the whole "Hadji-Bomb in a truck" is just not scary enough. That's something you could still watch on TV from a distance.

They need a much bigger "we're all in the gun sights together" binding existential threat again, to do what they want to do.

Doesn't even have to be a conspiracy in a smoke filled room, because from the Semi-Warrior point of view, it's a natural progression and rational self interest and in the end, the Americans public is looking for a binding force as much as they are.

It's "Missile Gap" all over again. Activism and aggression is the lifeblood and the overseas terrorists are just not putting up enough of a fight in response to it. That's played out.

They knew the Soviets were weak, but they never predicted that they would fold so quickly. Caught off guard they initially portrayed as a great victory and since the country was going gangbusters with the drop in the oil price, they could have their cake and eat it too.

However as the oil price has climbed and the economy tanked, pressure is being brought to bear, slowly but surely, to come up with something bigger than AQ, to keep the Long War going, and original the Semi-Warriors ain't.

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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 12:02 pm 
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Good Show Dan, thanks for the heads up on Vincent Brown. Hadn't heard of him before.
I don't the US is the only one to have these issues today. I saw a headline that the Prince Harry bare all in Vegas photos were banned from publication in the UK. Maybe we can get EU reporters to report on the US and broadcast in the US and we can do likewise for them.

It would be extremely compelling TV to watch a good reporter.

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 Post subject: Re: The DNN Episode
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 12:44 pm 
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Dan,

Great show. Forget about worrying if you've done this show before. I am a newer listener and I presume many others are as well. It was new to me and it was spot on. Also, it is one of the most important topics you cover, since it gets at the root of many of our problems in some way or another. Keep hammering away at this!


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